George and Lenny Are Always Together, Creative Process, and 40+ Years in Children’s Publishing

A podcast interview with Jon Agee discussing George and Lenny Are Always Together on The Growing Readers Podcast, a production of The Children’s Book Review.

An intimate conversation with award-winning author-illustrator Jon Agee about his heartwarming new picture book, George and Lenny Are Always Together.

In this delightful episode, Agee shares the creative journey behind his bear and rabbit duo who must navigate the delicate balance between togetherness and independence—a theme that resonates with readers of all ages. He opens up about his fascinating creative process, from guarding story ideas like “living little creatures” to his traditional art techniques, and reveals how his stories have evolved.

Whether you’re a parent, educator, or simply love great storytelling, this episode offers valuable insights into the art of picture book creation, the importance of friendship and solitude, and how the best children’s books speak to the child within us all. Agee’s gentle wisdom and decades of experience make this a must-listen for anyone interested in children’s literature and the creative process behind beloved books.

Subscribe to The Growing Readers Podcast to ensure you never miss an episode celebrating the creators shaping young readers’ lives.

Listen to the Episode

Read the Transcript

Bianca Schulze: Hi Jon Agee, welcome to the Growing Readers podcast. I’m so excited to have you today.

Jon Agee: Hi Bianca. Thanks for inviting me.

Bianca Schulze: Oh my gosh, such a pleasure. I’ve been reading your books for quite some time now. Before we go into your latest book, which I absolutely love, it’s like one of my brand new absolute favorites. I thought it would be fun to warm up with some rapid fire questions. And just so you know, the first thing that comes to mind is a great answer. And if you want to say pass, you can say pass. Ready to go?

Jon Agee: I’m sure, let’s do it.

Bianca Schulze: All right, what’s your go-to activity when you get some alone time?

Jon Agee: Well, that go-to activity I was going to do today, it’s kind of misting out. But I play tennis with a really sweet Chinese man who is 80 years old now. He doesn’t speak English. And we communicate via Google Translate on our text messages. Yeah, we’ve been playing for almost 10 years.

Bianca Schulze: I love that. I love that. That’s awesome. All right, well, when you were a kid, did you prefer playing with friends or having solo adventures?

Jon Agee: Friends, yeah, friends. We grew up on a little dead end street and so there were lots of children on that street, so of the same age, so yeah. There was lots of building forts and playing baseball in the middle of the street and in the wintertime, building tunnels in the snow.

Bianca Schulze: Awesome. Well, who would you choose if you had to be always together with one fictional character?

Jon Agee: One fictional character. Oh, goodness. God, I don’t know why I went and just saw Winnie the Pooh. I don’t know. Who am I? Yeah. Some wonderful character from a children’s book. That’s Eeyore. One of the characters from Pooh. Winnie the Pooh.

Bianca Schulze: I love it. I love it. And you know what the best thing about rapid fire questions is you can reserve the right to have a different answer another time. Well, do you prefer to brainstorm your story ideas with other people or completely solo?

Jon Agee: Solo, yeah, yeah, yeah. And very, very precious moments about just very guarded about ideas, almost like a living little creature that could dissolve. So I don’t want to share it with anybody until it’s, you know, more than just a little embryo. And then I’m really willing to ask my wife, Audrey, if she’d like to hear it out. But I often tell her, be kind. Yes, she’s brutally honest.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. Is she pretty honest with you? Yeah. Yeah. I love it. Well, it’s actually funny because I feel like I’m going to just, I’m going to go back to the rapid fire questions, but I feel like this is a fun tangent is that often, you know, when there’s an up and coming author, somebody that’s working on a book, you know, they say you need other people besides your family members to read your book because family members will be, you know, maybe over generous with their kindness, you know, but I have had the complete opposite experience. My family is brutally honest and I always start with them.

Jon Agee: Yeah, with Audrey, I mean, sometimes I would say 50% of the time I say, okay, enough, you have to leave. You said your piece. I’ll kind of slouch back to my room and pick up the pieces.

Bianca Schulze: I love it. Funny. All right, well, let’s go back to the rapid fire. So are you a morning time creator or a night owl illustrator?

Jon Agee: Well, mornings are really fertile, you know, the early mornings are precious times to doodle and sketch out thoughts for stories that I’m working on. But I used to be a night owl. But then, you know, I think as I got older, it was unsustainable to stay up till three or four in the morning. Those were interesting days back when I was in my 20s and 30s. Yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Well, what’s your favorite spot to be alone and work on your illustrations?

Jon Agee: A very comfortable couch or chair. Very comfortable, you know, just in quiet. Maybe the dog is next to me or something, but just quiet and the couch, I guess the couch is a good spot too. Yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. And then I think I know the answer to this one, but I’m going to ask it anyway. Digital tools or traditional art supplies or both?

Jon Agee: Traditional, yeah. I draw everything and paint everything on paper, but then I scan it into the computer. I’ve been doing that for the last five, six years or something, so I came to it a little late, but yeah.

Bianca Schulze: What’s one thing you absolutely must have with you when you’re creating?

Jon Agee: What am I creating? It’s not a talisman or there’s no, I don’t rub a little rabbit’s foot or anything. I don’t know. I love to, we’re going to have to pass on that one, because I don’t know if I have a favorite thing. I like to look up at my bookshelf and bring books down. I never cease to get inspired by other people’s books.

Bianca Schulze: Okay. Okay. Perfect. Okay, well then on that, which book was the last book to inspire you the most?

Jon Agee: Beatrice Alemagna, she’s a young illustrator in, I think she’s in Paris, although I think she’s Italian, but her book called Pepper and Me, it’s about a little girl who falls and gets a scab on her knee and she calls the scab Pepper and she wishes it would just go away because it’s ugly, you know. And eventually it does go away, but she misses it and it falls off, you know? And it’s such a sweet story. And her illustrations are just gorgeous. She’s unique. Then, but my favorite book of hers, was from a couple of years ago, called Things That Go Away. It’s just a profound, simple book for children, yeah. And grownups too.

Bianca Schulze: That’s, I can’t even imagine like the idea of writing about a scab. And I have not read this book and now I, 100%, I, when you say it’s about a scab, me, I’m like, I have to read this. How does this turn out to be one of the most recent inspiring picture books? You know, I can’t wait.

Jon Agee: Yeah. And it’s translated, I suppose, from Italian or French or something. And it reads really simply and beautifully. There’s some lessons in there that kind of creep up on you about parts of ourselves, physical parts that we don’t want. But then we realize there’s this connection. It’s lovely.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, well, one last rapid fire question. What’s the longest time it’s taken you to complete a single illustration?

Jon Agee: I can think of a book that I did years ago called Terrific about a grumpy guy who gets marooned on a little island with a parrot. And there was a picture I did that I must have done so many versions of it and I saved them and would give the old ones away. 20, 30, 40 times I redid it. That’s not including all the pencil sketches before that, you know? But I remember that one because in the end, when I got the final picture that’s in the book, it’s one of those experiences where my publisher used to say, well, why didn’t you think of that in the first place? He always used to say that.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I always think sometimes like we keep trying to come in the front door to solve a problem, but sometimes you have to climb down the chimney or through the window, right? And like, but it takes a while to figure it out.

Jon Agee: Right, right. Or what I often think is space, is putting a picture, putting it away for a while and coming back. And sometimes that distance you get from having worked on something again and again, day after day, you know, putting it aside can be kind of revelatory when you come back maybe a week or two later and say, what am I, what was I thinking? You know, here’s how to do it. Yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, yeah. Well, I have a question that I ask everybody when they’re a first time guest and it’s to be a writer. They say you need to be a reader first. So was there a pivotal moment in your life in which you first considered yourself a reader?

Jon Agee: Yeah. Sure. Yeah, I probably I don’t know when we’re reading when we’re actually reading this, you Edward Lear’s limericks, The Nonsense Book. You know, when those were six line poems and you could and they were funny poems about grownups doing silly things to themselves. I remember reading those. That must have been an early reading experience where my mother, my mother read them to us but then you know like you know there wasn’t there was an old lady from Chertsey who had a remarkable curtsy she twirled round and round until she sank underground you know that remarkable woman from Chertsey and they were easy to catch on because of the rhyme but yeah that was probably an early reading experience yeah. Also Margaret Wise Brown I’m just thinking.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, and do you think it was more of the…

Jon Agee: The little golden books. Margaret Wise Brown The Friendly Book was one. You know, I like cars. Red cars, green cars, sport limousine cars. I like cars. Still have that book. The cover is missing, but yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. Yeah. It sounds like maybe you were well drawn to humor, obviously, but also like rhythm. Maybe you connected with the rhythm of those.

Jon Agee: Yeah, yeah, I think that’s a good point for sure. I think there’s rhythm and poetry and poems. Yeah, yeah, for sure. Years later, in fact, I ended up writing the lyrics and the story for a couple of children’s musicals, which I absolutely loved that experience. I loved writing the lyrics and like writing the story and seeing the kids perform this musical. A lot of rhythm in that, but it wasn’t a career that was sustainable.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, what was it that motivated you to create books for children initially? And on the other end of the spectrum on that, like what’s guiding you now? And has anything changed for you since you first entered the industry? So what motivated you to start with? What’s guiding you now? And what’s changed in between.

Jon Agee: Okay. Well, okay, that’s good. Three parts. First part, I didn’t, I thought it was sort of accident, sort of like that I just got into the business kind of accidentally, which I kind of did. I was in New York and I just graduated from art school and I was looking for something to make a living in back in the late seventies, early eighties. And I thought, okay, I’ll just do my, these little drawings and see if I can get them published. You know? You know, cause New York had so many publishers back then that hadn’t consolidated into Penguin and Random House. You know? So you could just walk into these dusty offices and meet an actual editor and, you know, there wasn’t much money in it, but rent was cheap too, so. But when I look back at my childhood, I think I was right. My sister, we’re twins, and she’s an artist. She does ceramic art. She shows her work in a gallery. And when she was doing pictures, we were both doing pictures as kids, but my pictures were often part of stories. Some of my earliest pictures are John. I could write my name John, and I could write the word book. John Book, and I loved the idea of turning the pages. My mom would write in the, I would tell her the story and she would write in the words. It was something I didn’t really kind of understand until several years ago when I thought, God, I’ve been writing books since I was a little kid. It’s just, it just was kind of destiny, I guess. I don’t know about destiny, but it was meant to be, I guess. So that’s probably how I migrated or gravitated towards publishing. I didn’t know it at the time, I was, it was, it was pulling me in, you know. Now the second part of that question.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. What’s guiding you now?

Jon Agee: Right, right. What’s guiding me now? Hmm. Well, the probably the similar similar things that have always gotten me, which is the art of telling a good story of that, challenge of of drawing a reader in and keeping them amused and entertained and of course myself too and and into a kind of a little bit of a kind of an adventure or a journey that has enough heft enough substance in it that you feel at the end this you know this unique satisfaction like wow and an ending where you are kind of maybe possibly surprised but also you want to read it again? So, yeah, I think that and that’s a challenge continues to be a challenge because I fill notebooks filled with that they’re filled with story ideas that none of them ever see the light of day. And they’re great ideas for a premise for a story or they have, you know, they might have a great little passage that could be a story but. But they never coalesce into the final, into the 32 page thing that is this picture book thing, which is also its own unique kind of story, you know, having done them yourself, is how to kind of weave together text and pictures to where the pictures are dynamic and there’s things that pictures are informing you that the text steps back and the pictures step forward. All that stuff is the fine tuning of work and how illustrations are like that one I was just telling you about that I did so many times over. How to extract the most out of a out of a picture to make it, you know, to be faithful to the story, to the drama and the, boy, this is a long-winded answer.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, but you know what? That’s because I think it actually is long-winded to create a picture book, right? Right? It doesn’t just like, I mean, sometimes the manuscript might come fully formed in your mind, right? But then by the time that you are creating those nuanced moments between where you create the art, I only write words, I don’t create the art, but to then combine the art and to finesse it so perfectly like you do, you know, that is long-winded. So I love a long-winded answer. And I feel like so many people come on and they’re like, wait, that was a really long answer. And I’m like, it didn’t feel long to me. I was lost in it. I want to absorb all of this creativeness and beautiful, rich storytelling that you’re able to do. So I like that answer. But I want you to add to it because I want to know the in-between part.

Jon Agee: Very true, very true. Yeah, that’s a great observation because when I was doing picture books in the ’90s, most of my picture books were not about children. I mean, there were for children, but they were the protagonists of all my books were mostly middle-aged men. There was that book about Eugene who Terrific, who’s a grumpy guy who gets stranded on an island. There’s a book about a painter named Felix Clouseau who paints a duck which quacks. There’s a book about an antique dealer named Otis who it was, yeah, were a lot of books about, In fact, Emily Jenkins wrote a review of one of my books in the New York Times back then and she said that her quote, I’ll never forget it was, Jon Agee has made a career out of chronicling the masculine midlife crisis for preschool readers.

Bianca Schulze: That is perfection. I can see why you wouldn’t forget that line.

Jon Agee: Yeah. How To your point, the industry changed. Harry Potter had something to do with that. I think when I was writing those books about grownups and the nine year old fourth graders were reading picture books, when I would go to visit schools and part of my joy was the fourth graders because they all had good senses of humor. They understood irony, etc. And then Harry Potter came along and I think kind of those fourth graders gravitated towards novels or early readers. And I must have just instinctively known, hmm, I think I need to write about children. You know my books, you know. So that was a, that’s how I kind of like, I adapted to the times and I think my publishers were relieved. My first book with a child protagonist along with the rhinoceros was 2011 or something. I think 2009. Anyway, they were just, thank God Jon has finally decided to do a book about a kid. And that’s kind of been, I haven’t really done books about grownups since, yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Well, so I think we need to dig into the new book now. George and Lenny Are Always Together. I mean, I just Sometimes when I love a book so much, I don’t even know what to say about it, that this one like hits the spot. So what inspired you to create the characters of George and Lenny? And was there a specific friendship or relationship that influenced their dynamic for you? Where did they come from in your mind and your heart?

Jon Agee: I really should know I’m having a hard time thinking of where this all, I mean, I’ve been playing around with the idea of animals, two animals. And I know there have been so many books for children with bears and rabbits. So this is very, this is territory that’s traveled many times. But I just kept going back. There must be a reason why there’s so many books about bears, because bears, they stand on two feet. You know, they’re, they’re, they’re kind of, they’re just kind of adorable, but they can be all kinds of bears. There’s a lot of personality, different personalities you can extract from a bear. And a lot of my ideas for stories come from drawing people talking to each other, you know, mostly people, children talking to grownups, children talking to animals. And something out of this dialogue often turns into a story. In this case, it was a bear talking to a rabbit. And it was sort of like comic books, just dialogue, dialogue, dialogue. And I think it was that first line where the bear is very happy. They’re so friendly. He’s saying, you know, notice we were always together. And I thought, you know, sometimes my mind just goes literally, you know, like sort of almost like standup comedy. It’s like, you take the line literally and you play it out and you say, well, what if they were always together? That would be kind of strange that they’re never alone. And what if one of them, a lot of what ifs, you know. What if one of them decided, hey, I’d like to see what it’s like to be alone. And then that kind of helped establish the personalities of each character. The rabbit became suddenly evolved into a more cerebral less and the bear was more of your, more of a just this childlike kind of loving sweet person, but in the rabbit was more analytical, like, you know, and, and so that’s where it started. It’s funny because I, I think there’s parts of both characters in me, you know, so I think there’s, there’s elements to both characters that, you know, that came naturally to me because I can empath, I can identify with both George and Lenny, that very naive childlike bear and that kind of analytical, intelligent, you know, questioning rabbit.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. Well, I honestly think we’re all part George and part Lenny. So I love that you said that because that was what I have been thinking about. And, you know, I think what I like about it is when we get to an end of a really well-written picture book, there’s almost like a like there’s a there’s always like a solid closure moment, but there’s some sort of specialness where the reader gets to also add their own interpretation into what that story was for them. And so, you know, one might get to the end of this story and think that it’s about finding joy and companionship. And someone else might get to the end and feel like it’s a book about joy of, you know, in solitude. But at the same time, others might take away that it’s about all of the above, which that’s what it was for me. You know, I love that it could be any of those three responses right there would be correct. So was that something that you consciously set out to achieve or like, that just, did that just emerge as you created the story?

Jon Agee: I think most, when I’m working in books, I never really have a sense of what the message is. Sometimes I don’t have, I have no idea what they’re about. And then as they kind of wind down and we’re kind of finishing up the final touches, maybe my publisher will comment or somebody will tell me like, ah, so this book is about X Y and Z. And and it’ll spark a cord and say, oh, you’re right, you’re right, that is true. But for the most part, I’m just trying to make that story click and fall in love with the characters, of course. I mean, Even if they’re a bear or a rabbit or a grumpy old guy on a marooned island, I need to be engaged with the characters. But there’s also that that just that simple desire to make that story that grabbed me from the beginning. That premise, that little sketch that I did on a piece of paper in my notebook, have it, you know, take its little journey and have it as just almost like a jewel, you know, like where you come to the end and there’s no doubt that’s the way, that’s the perfect ending. That’s the way, that’s the rhythm, the timing, all that. And that’s where my publisher, Laurie Hornick, and my art director, Lily Malcolm, they’re, you know, they’re, I have my wife who’s a great judge, but then that other tier of judges, they’re right there to kind of make, to kind of hone that idea into a, into a into a book. I don’t know if that was a pretty long answer too.

Bianca Schulze: You know I like the long answers, so we’re good. Well, I think for me there’s such a lovely humor in how George, who’s a big bear, ends up following Lenny’s lead that’s so much smaller because Lenny’s a rabbit. And that, I think it’s that, and I just to throw out a big word, that juxtaposition, I think that’s why bears and rabbits work so well together because I mean the physicality of them like you know a rabbit can you know sort of stand up on its hind legs but maybe not quite so much as a bear but like there’s some physicalities that kind of match they’re fuzzy and whatnot but I think it’s the size of them. Like what does it take for you to infuse such a nuanced subtle humor into the book because or into into your books because Like I think that’s what creates those lovely aha moments is to be able to capture nuance, right? And I’ve talked about this with other creators like Matt De la Peña and Lauren Long were recently on the show and like it’s, I wanna, like you, they don’t want to share a message. They wanna capture a feeling. So like, what does that take? Do you even know? Is it just instinct? Or like, does it take a lot of thought? Like, what is it?

Jon Agee: Here’s an example with the writing and the illustration. There was a book years ago. It was about an astronaut named Demetri who goes to the moon and he’s been there for 22, two and a half years or something. And he comes back to planet earth. But while he was gone on planet earth, they had gone to many, he was on the moon for two and a half years. And while he was gone, astronauts had gone to much farther places and brought back these amazing artifacts from Pluto and Mars and asteroids and so forth. So when comes back, when Demetri comes back to the planet, there’s nobody there to greet him. There’s no fanfare. He’s been on the moon. He has his moon rocks with him in his sack of moon rocks. And then a ship passes by because he lands in the Pacific Ocean and brings him to New York City. And he has his space suit on the entire time. And he goes to Times Square and he holds up his sack of rocks and he says, hey everybody, it’s me, Demetri. I’m back from the moon. People just walk right by, you know, it’s New York. Who cares if a guy’s wearing a space suit? And so he figures something went wrong here. I’ve been on the, you know, while I was gone on the moon, nobody’s here to greet me. So he goes to the Museum of Intergalactic Space history or something like that to see like what’s been happening while I was on the moon. And sure enough, there’s this exhibit with all this amazing interplanetary relics that have been brought back to the planet Earth. And originally, the words described everything, you know, Demetri saw, you know, a Venusian, you know, splurge. You know, there was a fragment of the ring of Saturn, you know, there was a a plutonium asteroid or whatnot. And you see him looking up at all this. He’s a tiny little guy. And my publisher said, well, you know, this is a lot of text. Jon, why don’t you just, in the picture, in the illustration, you can have all those things that you’re describing in the text, but just put little signs next to each one of those things, you know, fragment of the ring of Saturn, you know, Venusian. So the text was basically, one or two sentences long. We went from this long description of everything he saw to just, you know, I think the text in the end said the exhibition had changed while he was away. Demetri was impressed. No description of all the things he was seeing because you saw them there, you know. You didn’t need to have all this, you know, this exposition. A long-winded way of saying how to get to simplicity in a picture book and when to and how to you know where you decide to take away words and have pictures do the work you know that was that always seems to me like a really good example.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, yeah it does because it’s, you know, even if your words are written in a way that’s showing, it’s still telling. And so by removing some of those words and placing the artwork in front of the reader, they get to be the intelligent one to solve that part of the story.

Jon Agee: Yeah. And to your point, you were talking about humor. I think by taking away the words, it allowed the reader, the child to see the humor because Demetri is very understated and any kid looking at that page would be saying, you know, wow, this guy has not figured it out. Because on the next page, he’s going to see that the exhibition for the moon is so pathetic. The it’s anyway it just it ramps up the the kind of the sad kind of humor of Demetri and I think that that’s so yeah we find ways to infuse that humor yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Yes. Well, with George and Lenny, you know, I feel like you have a really distinctive style of artwork. But do you want to walk us through your creative process for this book? Was it the same as recent books? I imagine it was pretty similar, but like just walk us through that creative process.

Jon Agee: Well, George, this was unique in a way because it was very, very simple pictures with no, the only background was a playground with no horizon line. And so the playground is swing set, seesaw, slide, parallel bars, jungle gym, and then finally, a tree house or whatever, a little house. So that was unique, but it was so dialogue driven and the dialogue was so simple that a child could read it just simply that I felt like it didn’t need too much detail in the rest of it. Just focus on their expressions, their body, their gestures. The important thing was that they continued to move through the book. There’s not much static. There’s always movement. Even when the rabbit finally ends up in the little tree house, he sits there for one spread and looks around and sees all the things that are inside the tree house. But then the next page, he’s involved with each item, all the little toys. Art supplies and so forth. So that was kind of unique, I guess. Yeah. I’m working on a sequel for the book in which there’s much more going on in the spreads. Yeah. But George and Lenny, this one, I loved the fact that it was a very minimal, was focused on their dialogue.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. Yeah. I think too, like with that without having a background, that playground could be wherever the reader lives, you know, like it could be anywhere in the world because the one constant in a playground is typically a slide and the swings and whatnot. Like, you know, like I like that idea that, you know, this could be the neighborhood park in your own neighborhood basically, just because there isn’t that backdrop.

Jon Agee: Yeah.

Bianca Schulze: So Is there a particular scene or moment in George and Lenny Are Always Together that is a favorite for you or like, you know, a moment that you love the most?

Jon Agee: I read this too when I first had a Xerox version of this book, I was at a school and I was reading it out loud to the kids and I almost came to tears at this one page when they say goodbye to each other. Because it’s such a funny spread because George, when they decide to be apart, to be alone, George really, he doubles down with Lenny says, you sure you want to be alone? And Lenny says, yes, George, I do. And then you turn the page and George slump shoulder, just walking away saying, well, goodbye, Lenny. But he’s saying goodbye, But it’s so sweet. It, you know, I got choked up reading it to the kids in the school. I like, had to take a pause there. Anyway, I do love that. That’s that goodbye scene.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, and you know, I think This is the kind of book that, I mean, as adults, we have experienced goodbyes and we have experienced loss of friendship in maybe different ways that kids have. And so, like, I think that’s why this book hit me. Like, I mean, I felt a bit emotional as I was reading it as well. I’m like… This is, it’s, you know, I think for a kid, it’s fun and it’s enjoyable. But for the adult readers, it’s actually really poignant. Like it’s, it really is, it really is.

Jon Agee: Well, it does it for me too. That page, well, I mean, I think there’s a sweetness to this book that is maybe more unique than other books I’ve done. I mean, the connection between these two, it’s very gentle, you know. It’s funny, but it’s very soft.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, yeah, I think it’s perfect. So I, you know, I, I feel based on what I’m gleaming from you as the kind of creator that you are, that like, maybe this isn’t a question that you love to answer, but it’s like, it’s the kind of question, like, I have to always ask. What do you hope children and perhaps adults take away from George and Lenny’s adventure, this first one? Like what do you hope is if they were to take away one thing, what would it be?

Jon Agee: I don’t know. It’s something, I mean, I’ll tell you, the only experience I have is less thinking about that right now, but when I’m reading to kids at schools, and which I don’t, I usually tell books when I’m at school, so I’m kind of entertained, I’m kind of performing the books. So maybe that’s not fair. But when I’m reading to a kid and I noticed that it really riveted to the story. I have no idea what’s going through their minds, but when they want to read it again, that’s sweet when they want me to read it again. I remember there was, I did a book called The Wall in the Middle of the Book and kids were asked like what they had learned from that book and it’s kind of too… something you said earlier, which is all the different things you can glean from the same story. They sent me this class, 10 different things that they’d all felt that they could learn from that book. Don’t judge a book by its cover. It’s good to think before you make a judgment. It was lots of different things that they… learn well I guess they learn from that book I I don’t really ever think too much about what kids are learning I guess my motivation is to to to to engage with them to make them to make them think to make them laugh I do want them to be amused I really do find I mean that’s important to me but also to to to expand their imagination too. I think there’s some part of my books there that is, that I figure they’re like, whoa, how did he do it? I didn’t expect that story to go this way. Or I set up a premise which is kind of implausible and then it all makes sense. There’s a logic to it that a child can can see that yeah, that’s true. So a rhino, I mean, there’s a book I have where a rhinoceros, kid buys a rhinoceros, gets a rhinoceros from a pet store, takes it home and throws a ball and a stick and a frisbee and the rhinoceros just stands there. And then he calls a rhinoceros expert and she explains that a rhinoceros can only do two things. It can either pop a balloon with their horn or or poke a hole in a kite. And so he’s kind of, he thinks, I don’t know about this. And then it turns out the rhinoceros doesn’t even do that. But in the end of the book, the rhinoceros not only can pop a balloon and poke a hole in a kite, he foils a robbery by popping a balloon that the robber’s getting away in a hot air balloon. And he pops the balloon and then the other robber’s getting away in a hang glider kite and he pokes a hole in that. So in the end of the book, as I say to the kids, so this, this, the police, the police run up to the little kid and is this your rhinoceros? And the kid says, yes. And just, well, you’ve got a very special one. He can pop balloons and poke holes and kites. And the kid says, yeah. And you might’ve also noticed that he gets back on, he gets on the back of the rhinoceros and he can fly too, you know? So I mean, there’s elements to that, which, you know, the kids just go with it and their imagination is like, yes, that rhinoceros can fly. There’s always going to be one kid who says, And they’ve asked me this, excuse me, how does that rhinoceros fly? I said, well, it his legs really, really fast. So yeah.

Bianca Schulze: Oh man, I love it. Well, Jon, it has been such a delight talking with you today about George and Lenny Are Always Together. And you know, I cannot tell you enough how happy this book has made me. Because of the way that you’ve so cleverly captured that delicate balance that I think we all need in our lives, the comfort of deep friendship alongside the growth that comes from independence. So between your artwork and gentle humor, you’ve created characters children, I believe, will instantly connect with while also exploring universal themes that I think resonate at any age and I know so many of us, whether we’re parents, educators, and children, we’re going to recognize ourselves, like we said before, in both George and Lenny’s journey. Because you see yourself in both, and I know I saw myself in both. So I just want to thank you for crafting a story that reminds us that true friendship gives us both roots and wings, even if we’re rhinoceros. So the security to explore on our own and the joy of coming back together again. And just a huge, huge, huge, huge thank you for being here today.

Jon Agee: You’re very welcome. Thank you.

Show Notes

Publisher’s Book Summary: This rabbit and bear are inseparable best friends—until now, that is! An irresistible, funny read for fans of Frog & Toad and Elephant & Piggie.

George and Lenny are always together. And it’s terrific. They are never alone! So what happens when one of them decides it’s time to try some alone time? Is there a way for them to be alone together?

Award-winning picture book creator Jon Agee is at his very best in this endearing, silly story of friendship—of asserting yourself, taking a risk, and still being there for your best buddy.

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About Jon Agee: Jon Agee is an award-winning author and illustrator with over 40 years in children’s publishing. Known for his distinctive humor and storytelling style, Agee has created numerous beloved picture books. His career evolved from writing about adult protagonists in the 1990s to focusing on child characters, adapting to industry changes while maintaining his signature blend of gentle humor and meaningful themes. He has also written lyrics and stories for children’s musicals.

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Credits:

• Host: Bianca Schulze
• Guest: Jon Agee
• Producer: Bianca Schulze

The Growing Readers Podcast celebrates children’s literature and its power to inspire a lifelong love of reading.